Danger Den NV-68 GPU Water Block Review

Water Cooling by KeithSuppe @ 2005-06-07

Danger Den continues to be an innovator in water cooling. Their NV-68 Rev. 1.1 GPU/memory water block is a massive H20 copper cooler designed specifically to tame the nVidia 6800 line of graphic cards. Incorporating both GPU and memory cooling this is bound to be an Overclocker?s dream. Madshrimps bolts this baby to a BFG 6800GT PCI-ex OC (370MHz core speed) and tests the NV-68 in linear as fed from a PolarFLO TT CPU-water block. In this respect we will also measure performance difference (if any) from single, then twin outlets (ports). You might need your thermal-undies and a dictionary for this one; so bundle up, hang on, read on.

Introduction/Preparation

If your located in the USA and have some PC-water cooling experience, your no doubt familiar with the name Danger Den. Based in Oregon, the company rose from a niche copper water block maker to one of the largest names in the business. Danger Den attracted their current market share incorporating cutting edge design, reliability and affordability. With the release of the triple barb RBX followed by the diminutive foot-print of the TDX Danger Den design's offer righteous performance value. Today we evaluate their NV-68 Rev 1.1, one of the earliest of a rapidly growing number of graphic card cooler's designed to cool both the GPU and memory on nVidia 6XXX series of graphic cards.

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Perhaps the most critical aspect of any water block besides basic material (copper, silver, etc.) would be impingement and flow characteristics. Where multi-block systems are concerned the secondary block in-line such as GPU and chipset coolers are often designed differently from CPU water blocks. Many don't meet the criteria for an impingement zone per-se. The impingement zone is usually defined as the area within the water block sitting directly above the CPU-core and it's this surface the incoming water-stream will first "impinge." Ideally the impingement zone is where most of the processor's heat will be conducted. There are several basic designs for impingement zones and some work in conjunction with a specific Intel design. For example, Danger Den utilizes "accelerator nozzles" on their TDX water block, thereby fine-tuning the inlet water stream. Where multiple blocks are used in linear there's bound to be a drop in pressure as well as a rise in temperature from block to block. For these reasons many graphic card coolers are designed around minimizing flow restriction. The NV-68 seems to epitomize these characteristics with it's wide channels seen below.

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As seen in the photo above, Danger Den engineers machined a continuous channel originating from the inlet wrapping around the block over each pair of memory chips to the outlet. The area above GPU has a series of small curved channels which concentrate water-flow above the GPU creating an agglomerating effect for maximum heat absorption.

Below we see the NV-68's mounting system utilizes four spring-loaded bolts which slide through the water block, the graphic card, finally pass through a foam pad and Lucite plate. Copper hand-fasteners tighten down springs securing the entire assembly for an even distribution of mounting pressure. The system is simple and works very well. I was able to mount the NV-68 in matter of seconds and the most time consuming job was removing and re-applying the included thermal paste for Arctic Silver Ceramique.

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Test Subject (video-card): BFG 6800GT OC PCI-ex

This card features 256MB of Samsung 2.0ns memory and based on NVIDIA’s NV45 GPU with HIS bridging chip the card features 16 fully active pipelines. BFG overclocks the GPU from NVIDIA’s default speed of 350MHz to 370MHz. To prepare the card I used Arctic Silver ArcticClean to remove any thermal paste and prep surfaces for Ceramique. This paste’s non-conductive properties are essential given the number of SMDs on the NV45. Removing the active cooler (fan assembly) reveals an aluminum heatsink and black aluminum heat-pipe memory sink to cool the BFG 6800GT's Samsung memory. Most 6800's now utilize heat-pipe technology.

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Disassembling the BFG 6800GT I came upon the realization this card may not be so easy to "tame" after all. Its heat signature is somewhat more involved then simply cooling a "single" GPU. In the photo below it's clear from the thermal paste "foot-print" on the underside of the GPU heatsink, there's not one, but two chips to cool.

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Native PCI-ex GPUs for 6800 series graphic cards have been absent from the market to date. This has left manufacturers with NVIDIA’s ad hoc solution in the form of a PCI-ex "bridging-chip" located just below the NV45 core (seen in the photo below after cleaning with ArcticClean).

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The NV45 is basically an NV40 with a PCIe bridging chip. The chip has no discernable marking's and it's generally agreed the HIS chip has no adverse effect's on performance. Given the fact PCI-ex 6800GT versions have this additional chip; we can safely assume they have their own heat signature as well. Reading through 6800GT reviews, technical articles and countless forum posts, I discovered many end-users whom had previously owned an AGP version 6800GT, then purchased the PCI-ex 6800GT version were seeing an approximate 10C rise in temp between the two. This piqued my interest for several reasons, foremost were my temps which I felt were quite high. I thought perhaps this was a result of the BFG 6800GT OC which is overclocked 20MHz by default to 370MHz core speed. I decided to "under-clock" the card running it at NVIDIA’s specified 350MHz core/1000MHz memory frequencies. On the left the BFG is running at the model’s OC frequency 370MHz/1000MHz, on the right the same card running at NVIDIA's stock 350MHz/1000Mhz frequencies.

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I originally tested the NV-68 on the eVGA 6800GT AGP version mated with the Asus P4C800E-dlx and Prescott 3.0E. I used exactly the same components found in our proprietary H20 system for this review, as follows: Hydor L-45 pump (2800l/h 2.3m Head-ft), Danger Den double heater core (2x120mm/92CFM Sunons (pull)), and a Danger Den Bay reservoir, on 1/2" tubing. Below I’ve provided two thumbnails to screenshots comparing these cards running on the same dedicated system (proprietary) used in this review. On the left the NV68 cooling the eVGA on the Asus P4C800E-dlx/3.0E test system cited above. The system is running at default speeds (15x200FSB = 3.0GHz) the eVGA is overclocked from 350/1000MHz to 425/1151MHz IDLE. The right thumbnail shows the NV-68 cooling the BFG 6800GT OC for this review, same dedicated system at IDLE, however; the BFG is running at default speed for that card, 370/100MHz. Although the AGP based eVGA is overclocked, it's still running showing a 12C drop in temps compared to the BFG PCIe card with the additional bridging chip. While the theory may not be irrefutable the premises is valid, and the results were repeatable. The ambient temp was a few degrees lower during the eVGA test, however; it certainly wouldn't account for such a large discrepancy between temps.

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Installing the NV-68 GPU/memory cooler wasn't difficult, however; I was somewhat concerned about the weight (leverage) acting upon the PCIe 16x slot. The NV-68 is undoubtedly the heaviest water block of any type I've ever used. Without a proper scale I cannot be sure, but I'd venture to guess this cooler weighs at least 500gr.

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Visible in the background, our PolarFLO TT is feeding the NV-68 from a single port (outlet). Given the flow characteristics I alluded to earlier, we'll begin by determining if there is a difference in temps if the NV-68 is fed using the PolarFLO-TT's single or dual outlets.

Tests Single/Dual (feed)

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The photo above was taken for "eye candy" reasons, although as I began testing the NV-68 with Corsair XMS Xpert-3200 I did achieve 7.4GB/s bandwidth on this system running XPert at 11x250HTT. With the AMD on-die memory controller I ran SPD timing’s of 2-3-2-5, as opposed to my initial Intel P4/Xpert OC 15x250FSB (875 Asus) at 2-4-4-8 resulting in just 5.7GB/s bandwidth, but that's another review.

Test System
CPU A64 3500+ (2210MHz (Winchester core 90nm)) Socket-939
Mainboard DFI LANPARTY NF4 UT (BIOS 310)
Memory G-Skill DDR600 2x256MB DC
Graphics BFG 6800GT OC (370/1000MHz) NVIDIA 71.89 WINXP Drivers
Power Supply Thermaltake Silent Pure Power 680
CASE Thermaltake Kandalf aluminum Tower
Cooling PolarFLO TT CPU waterblock, Danger Den NV-68, Hydor L-40II Pump, Danger Den Double Heater Core, 2x120mm/92CFM fans, 1/2"
Operating System WindowsXP Home SP2


Test Methodology

Two thermistors running from the TTGI SF-610 were used to measure external (Ambient) temp, and a second was placed as close to the NV45 GPU as possible without adversely affecting mounting (contact between heatsink and GPU). Primarily GPU temperatures will primarily be determined by Riva Tuner 2.0 15.5 which monitors the NV45 on-die thermal diode. The nVidia on-die thermal diode seems to be fairly accurate, regardless thermistor placement is not an exact science. To record results including temps, frequencies etc. during IDLE, a combination of monitoring utilities will be captured in screenshots. For CPU temps and frequency the A64 on-die thermal diode will be monitored using ITE Smart Guardian. To indicate FSB speeds, and processor data CPU-Z will also be used. Finally for additional real-time clock speed WCPUCLK will be used. The screenshot below exemplifies how temps, and frequencies were recorded for this review.

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For LOAD the combination of utilities will only vary slightly. CPU-Z will be used throughout, insofar as HTT and CPU speed these will remain constant running GSkill DDR600 (2x256MB) with the A64 3500+ at 9x300HTT = 2.7GHz on our DFI LANPARTY NF4 ULTRA-D.

  • GPU-Core-temp as indicated in Riva Tuner will be our primary source throughout.
  • GPU Ambient found at the very bottom of the RivaTuner GUI will be recorded also as this represents the current temperature of the PCB board.
  • The Room temp found in all charts is the recorded ambient temp using a thermistor from the TTGI SGF-610. This thermistor was placed just inside the case, which remained open to ensure there was no differential between Case and Ambient. This is crucial due to the size of the radiator.

    To stress the BFG 6800GT GP and memory the program used will be Rthdribl v.1.2 (Real-Time High Dynamic Range Image-Based Lighting) just as the name implies the program demonstrates DirectX(R) 9.0, and Pixel-Shader 2.0. Most useful for our purposes is the drag-and-drop window so screenshots can be taken simultaneously with temperature monitoring/frequency GUI's.

    Many H20 enthusiast's are now using double, even triple radiators most of which are mounted externally on their case. Our goal is to determine how well the NV-68 can remove a specific amount of heat from the card it's mated with. Whether the radiator is in the case or outside the case has no bearing on how well the waterblock itself "performs" this task. Obviously if the air surrounding the radiator is 35c then we know the waterblock cannot "cool" the GPU any lower, this process is dictated by thermal equilibrium. For those skeptical about the use of internal thermal diodes, a quote from the following article may help; "...the diode/motherboard combination can display temperatures that are off by up to 6C or so from the actual temperature. This error is constant, so it does not affect the usefulness of the internal diode as a test device. A change to the cooling system that changes the temperature reading by 3C IS a 3C change regardless of whether the diode shows it as 43 to 40, or 38 to 35, or 40 to 37. The diode may lie, but it always tells the same lie."


    Testing in linear Single-feed setup

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    Testing in linear Dual-feed setup

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    The Thumbnails below each correlate to data found in the Temp Chart (Excel Spread Sheet) on the bottom of this page.

    BFG running Stock-air cooler @ IDLE 370MHz Core/1000MHz Memory (CPU 9x300HTT = 2700MHz) LEFT/RIGHT - LOAD

    Madshrimps (c) Madshrimps (c)

    BFG @ IDLE 370MHz Core/1000MHz Memory (CPU 9x300HTT = 2700MHz) Single Feed (PolarFLO TT) - NV-68 LEFT/RIGHT - Dual Feed

    Madshrimps (c) Madshrimps (c)

    BFG @ LOAD 370MHz Core/1000MHz Memory (CPU 9x30HTT = 2700MHz) Single Feed (PolarFLO TT) - NV-68 LEFT/RIGHT - Dual Feed

    Madshrimps (c) Madshrimps (c)



    Danger Den NV-68 Proprietary Cooling

    Madshrimps (c)

    For our proprietary cooling tests I replaced the PolarFLO TT for CPU cooling with Alphacool's Xtreme Pro Set and their NexXxos XP BOLD AMD 64. With the NV-68 on a proprietary system graphic card temps should improve significantly. As done previously we'll show screenshots taken running the BFG 6800GT at IDLE and then under LOAD using Rthdribl. The screenshots below exemplify the NV-68 on a proprietary system. All components used in the previous system have been left in place, with the primary feed now running from the radiator directly into the NV-68.

    NV68 proprietary BFG @ IDLE 370MHz/1000MHz (CPU 9x300HTT = 2700MHz) LEFT/RIGHT = BFG @ LOAD

    Madshrimps (c) Madshrimps (c)


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  • Overclocking/Conclusion

    Overclocking

    Overclocking focused on pushing our BFG 6800GT OC as far as possible while achieving total stability in 2D/3D performance. BFG sells this card as part of their OC series, in this case the core speed runs 20MHz above the usual 350MHz 6800GT core speed. Since Ultra 6800's run at 400MHz core, and the chip is purportedly the same animal this isn't such a great achievement, however; BFG's 6800 Ultra OC runs at 425MHz.

    In every case, albeit air-cooled or water-cooled this card easily met 6800 Ultra speeds, and then BFG 6800 Ultra OC specs which is, at the very least indicative of BFG finding some decent GPU-lots. To save space I've excluded 3d benchmark scores per-se, although I did run/record these test results including all Futuremark, Doom-3, and Far Cry to ensure the card was stable under all conditions. This is, however; a water block review, not a graphic card review, hence our primary concern will be temps.

    While it's well known among the Overclocking and Enthusiast community’s temperature always affects performance, it would be presumptuous to think this is common knowledge.

    For this reason I've chosen several 3DMark03 scores exemplifying how lower temp's can improve actual scores. Below I've included several thumbnails each corresponding to a 3DMark03 result. First (left) 3DMark03 result screenshot represents the BFG 6800GT OC running at its default speeds (370MHz/1000Mhz) with its stock-air cooler. The second (center) screenshot represents 3DMark03 result running the BFG 6800GT at default speeds water-cooled by the NV-68 in a closed (proprietary) system. The final (right) screenshot represents 3DMark03 result overclocking the BFG at 440MHz/1150MHz, once again NV-68 water-cooled on a closed (proprietary) system.

    In each case BIOS settings remained the unchanged, including Vcore, VDIMM, CPU speed, FSB and memory timings (9x300HTT = 2700MHz).

    Madshrimps (c) Madshrimps (c) Madshrimps (c)


    Since there's no way to record temps while 3DMark03 is running, temps as indicated by RivaTuner Hardware Monitoring (GUI included in the screenshots) are not representative of temps during the benchmark itself. Although the screenshots were taken just moments after the benchmarks completed, as you may be aware, micro-chip temps will stabilize (drop) in milliseconds back to their prior level. This is primarily attributable to the effectiveness of your cooling system, other reasons would require several lengthy papers on thermodynamics and micro-electronics, for which I'm often criticized of delving in-too deeply in my reviews. Regardless our goal in this particular section was to show the end-result, being the 3DMark03 score. In fact during temp testing I discovered Rthdribl places much more stress on the card then any Futuremark, DOOM-3, or Far Cry benchmark as I discovered hap-hazardly after running the first series of Futuremark benchmarks with the card overclocked, only to have it fail when I ran Rthdribl.


    Overclocking the BFG 6800GT with the NV-68

    As found on the previous page, I've included the screenshots (via thumbnails) so here's no doubt these temp/results were ran and recorded. While I find it hard to believe anyone would falsify graphs I'm sure it has happened, however; this is not the reason I supply the screenshots. The additional information contained therein may be useful. For example Smart Guardian also displays chipset temp, and PWM-IC (Power Circuits on the motherboard). Depending how in-depth one would venture, seemingly superfluous data can be extrapolated into valuable theory.

    BFG @ IDLE 411MHz/1105MHz stock-air cooling LEFT/RIGHT - LOAD

    Madshrimps (c) Madshrimps (c)

    BFG @ IDLE 440MHz/1127MHz Single Feed (PolarFLO TT) - NV-68 LEFT/RIGHT Dual Feed IDLE

    Madshrimps (c) Madshrimps (c)

    BFG @ LOAD 440MHz/1127MHz Single Feed (PolarFLO TT) - NV-68 LEFT/RIGHT Dual Feed LOAD

    Madshrimps (c) Madshrimps (c)

    BFG @ IDLE 440MHz/1150MHz Proprietary H20 LEFT/RIGHT LOAD Proprietary H20

    Madshrimps (c) Madshrimps (c)


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    Epilogue

    Danger Den released their venerable NV-68 nVidia water block almost a year ago, and it sat in my room for several months waiting to be strapped to a PCIe 6800 version. When I'd first tested this GPU/memory cooler it was with an AGP based eVGA 6800GT and the temps were simply amazing. I achieved some exceptional overclocking, and best of al the temps were so low I could have ran the card forever at these speeds. That is the test of a true performer.

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    Conclusion:

    Danger Den lists the NV-68 at $125 MSRP, it can probably be found less somewhere other then their store. FrozenCPU is now offering an NV-68 SLI kit for $232, and I can't think of a better H20 SLI solution at the moment. If I had one complaint about this block it would be the weight which is most likely un-avoidable if one wants the same performance, and the 1/2" ID which is an entirely separate issue. I simply feel 1/2" ID system are not worth the absence of ergonomics for the purported performance gain to be had with the additional water volume. Insofar as 1/2" GPU/memory coolers are concerned, this has to be one of, if not the best on the market. Danger Den was one of if not the first to incorporate memory and GPU water cooling into a single solution; they are pioneers in many respects. I proudly bestow my highest rating for the NV-68 a pH7. I'd like to thank Dan (if he still remembers me) at Danger Den for being so understanding with my postponement of this article.


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