“People have turned off their fridges to save money”

CLIP- A century since the BBC was founded, for the first time in its history this is Castfest, from BBC News podcasts. [Applause]

NIKKI- We’re at Castfest.

EMMA- Where Newscast, Ukrainecast and Americast recorded an episode of their podcasts, and we popped up in the middle. 

NIKKI- Now we’re in a bar in the BBC media café.

EMMA- It was a little bit more formal than maybe we’re used to. I did talk about touching naked people in changing rooms and slapping people on the head whilst swimming. How was the ramp in the radio theatre? 

NIKKI- What a gradient! What a gradient!

EMMA- Did you have Kate Bush in your head going, running up that hill?

NIKKI- Yeah.

EMMA- A couple of people said, ‘Nikki, doing that big run-up to that ramp!’

NIKKI- It wasn’t that bad. I mean, I’ve done bigger ramps in my sleep, Emma.

EMMA- I’m sort of surprised we didn’t hear someone shout, ‘You need a licence for that thing!’ as you were going up towards the ramp. 

NIKKI- Did you get nervous?

EMMA- I was a bit nervous because we hadn’t time to practise. I think if we got on stage and did a live podcast I might be a little bit nervous, but I’d be absolutely pumped.

NIKKI- That’s our mission for next year.

EMMA- Because I think we would smash it and I think we’d have such a good time. Cheers baby.

NIKKI- Cheers darling. 

MUSIC- Theme music. 

VICTORIA- I would like you to meet Nikki Fox and Emma Tracey, who are hosts of our disability news podcast, which is called Access All. It is superb, and the relationship between these two women, I have to say, is wonderful to listen to.

NIKKI- She was very complimentary, wasn’t she, Victoria Derbyshire?

EMMA- It was way longer than I remember. 

NIKKI- Wasn’t it exciting, like being in that radio theatre, for Castfest? For listeners that don’t know, Castfest is kind of a culmination of all the brilliant pods, Newscast, Americast, Ukrainecast. They’re phenomenally popular, aren’t they? People just absolutely love those podcasts.

EMMA- They’re Top of the Pods basically when it comes to podcasts.

NIKKI- They’re Top of the Pods, exactly. It was like a live podcast recording, wasn’t it, of all of them. 

EMMA- Yeah, and it was 100 years since the BBC started. It was on the 100th anniversary on that very day. They had the microphone that was used really on in BBC radio, an enormous old mic that Chris Mason was speaking into. It was great to be there. Then we had Ukrainecast at the end and some really beautiful music by some Ukrainian musicians. There wasn’t a dry eye in the house. It was a huge honour to be there on that special day, in that special place, and with all those special people. To get on stage and tell people about Access All was really good. We did get to mess about a little bit, which made me happy as well. 

[Clip] Well, I think we just have a great time because we have such a good relationship. We didn’t even know each other before we started recording Access All, and as soon as we came into a studio together we clicked. And we learn stuff from each other, and we talk about our lives and our life experiences, and sort of bring in other people’s disabled experience from what we’ve known from being disability focused journalists for so long. And in one of the first episodes I spoke about the issues around going swimming solo when you can’t see, so trying to move around changing rooms without touching naked people [laughter]; trying entirely unsuccessfully to swim in a straight line and not smack someone on the head. Just really simple things that disabled people know about and non-disabled people don’t necessarily know about. And then I went on to talk about more recently the fact that I’ve started swimming in the sea – and I’ve spoken to other visually impaired people about this as well – and it’s got no walls, and it’s got no people, and it’s freedom. When you’re blind you don’t always get as much freedom because you’re relying on people often to guide you around or different things like that. But when you’re in the sea it’s this massive vast. And it’s just bringing experiences. 

NIKKI- What I love about Emma is she’s so brilliant. Like I went to a Fleet Foxes gig with my sister a couple of months ago in Manchester. I had a great time. And we were talking about the whole experience, because it actually went really, really well. And that doesn’t often happen. And Emma came up with a cracker like, ‘Oh you know when you went through – she said – did you have to prove that you were disabled?’ I was like, ‘Do you know what Emma, funnily enough, two disabled girls – because my sister’s disabled – in electric wheelchairs, with headrests, didn’t have to prove they were disabled to get in’.

VICTORIA- It was a clue. 

NIKKI- It was, yeah. But she lines me up for these corkers. 

VICTORIA- Well, that’s what I love about you both: you’re completely open and honest. 

NIKKI- I was so nervous, Emma. I don’t know why because I’m normally good in front of a crowd; I’m used to doing it. But you can hear it in my voice, can’t you? 

EMMA- Well, you can hear it in my voice as well. Maybe that’s because you turned up at like three minutes to the recording. 

NIKKI- All right, Tracey, all right. I’m not always late, I’m not always late.

EMMA- But it’s usually a disability related reason. 

NIKKI- It was. 

EMMA- Do you know what I mean?

NIKKI- We were trying to check into the hotel and they hadn’t booked us the accessible room with the interconnecting room that I needed for Libster, Libby, my PA. It did feel like quite a moment actually, 100 years. I’m very proud to work for the BBC. I love working for the BBC.

EMMA- And there is photographic evidence of that beautiful moment with all of us in a photo, which I’m told is nice. 

NIKKI- She looked absolutely beautiful. She had a long dress on. 

EMMA- Styled by my lovely mother. That photo will be on our Twitter feed if you want to take a look at us. Justin Webb is right behind me, Marianna Spring is to my left.

NIKKI- Chris Mason is pulling the most extraordinary face, it’s just brilliant. 

You can’t beat a bit of protesting by disability campaigners, and this week Reverse the Ban in York have been out in force. Now, last year City of York council said it had to prohibit parking in the city to prevent terror attacks. But the Reverse the Ban campaign, which brings together 27 organisations in the city, says the ban discriminates against disabled residents and visitors. Now, this week campaigners delivered a petition, and 2,700 postcards to the council calling it to reverse its ban on Blue Badge parking in the city centre. Diane Roworth, from York Sight Loss Council, who’s part of the campaign group, said it has massively affected the disability community. 

DIANE- Virtually the whole of the city centre is inaccessible to people who need a Blue Badge in order to get close to where they want to be. One of the things that we’re going to tonight to the council is to present the petition. That petition is backed up by 2,700 postcards that have been signed by individual members of the public, asking the City of York Council to reverse the ban on Blue Badge holders and saying, look York’s a human rights city, it should not be acting in this way. We just want the council to understand we are real people, this ban is really affecting not just us, but our families and our friends. And it’s affecting business too because there are so many businesses that no longer have disabled people as customers. And that isn’t right. 

NIKKI- Another member of Reverse the Ban, Marilyn, she left us a voice note – thank you so much, Marilyn – with some of the statements people had written on the back of their postcards. 

MARILYN- This action has closed my world down. My disabled husband can no longer visit the city that he loves. The impact of the ban has taken an intense toll on the emotional and mental health of myself, my friends and family. Visiting my beloved city centre is no longer an option. Allowing us to enter before 10:30 and after 7 casts disabled people and Blue Badge holders as second class citizens. I’ve lost my independence and my liberty. I can’t bring my kids into the city centre for activities as my son and I are both disabled, and he can’t manage buses. I miss feeling like I belong and am welcome here. My daughter, who is a wheelchair user and grew up in York and loves to visit, now feels excluded and finds it difficult to come home. Her quality of life has been significantly affected. I got a Blue Badge purely to have better access to this city via taxi; now it’s useless. Disabled people deserve access to everything able-bodied people do. We shop, have appointments, meet friends and family, we party; you’re blocking us from living our lives. 

EMMA- We did contact City of York council but they haven’t come back to us. 

NIKKI- Well, we’ll keep on top of that. Yeah, it’s awful. 

EMMA- It feels like they’re losing out on tourism as well, because it’s a huge tourism city as well. So, if you’re disabled and thinking of going there for a visit and you look at the no parking for Blue Badge holders maybe you won’t go. 

NIKKI- Yeah. now, if you’ve got questions or just comments you can tweet us @BBCAccessAll. You can also send us an email accessall@bbc.co.uk. Or if WhatsApp’s your thing, which it very much is mine, our number is 0330 123 9480, and you can send us an audio note or a message. But please if you can put the word Access at the beginning. 

EMMA- Speaking of which, we’ve actually had an email from David Apps saying, thank you for your excellent podcast, but please explain why you want us to start our messages with the word Access. 

NIKKI- Well, thank you first of all, David, for emailing us and saying that the podcast was excellent. That’s very nice, isn’t it, Ems? Now, really when it comes to putting the word Access you’re kind of throwing us a bone, David, because we basically share our WhatsApp number with all the other big-hitting podcasts, like Newscast, Americast and Ukrainecast. And it makes our lives just that bit easier if we can identify straightaway the messages that are meant for us, and we can do that kind of nice and quickly. So, you can either say it at the start of your voice note, or just text the word before sending us a voice note. But when it comes to emails you can choose whatever subject line you like, like Oi, You Two. 

EMMA- David’s actually his subject line was Emma Is Great, or something like that. 

NIKKI- Oh, was it, Ems?

EMMA- I mean, I’m not expecting that from a subject line, but that was one of my favourite subject lines so far. 

NIKKI- It’s safe to say we are living through a very unsettled time at the moment. That’s a bit of an understatement. One of the biggest concerns for a lot of disabled people is how benefits will measure up against the cost of living crisis and the record rise in inflation. Earlier this week it was announced that inflation had gone up by 10.1% in the past year, which in simple terms that means prices for things like food and fuel are all on the rise, and at their fastest rate in 40 years. Emma, tell me, why is inflation and that figure so important? 

EMMA- Inflation is important, Nikki, because it’ll be used to help calculate April’s annual review in benefits. So, now the government is under pressure to confirm if these payments will rise in line with inflation, and that’s that figure of 10.1%, or by a much smaller amount. For context, the standard rate of Universal Credit has increased by 7.5% since 2013, and in the same time period inflation has increased by 22.9%.

NIKKI- Now, I know a lot of charities, including Sense, Scope and Barnardo’s have called on the government to stand by its manifesto commitment to raise all benefits in line with inflation. But the charity Sense also released new research this week, didn’t it Emma?

EMMA- It found that disabled people are three times more likely to be behind on bills, in debt, unable to afford a  healthy diet, or to heat their home, than those without a disability. And that rises to eight times more likely than non-disabled people if they have complex needs. 

NIKKI- Now, in a moment we’re going to speak to James Taylor from Scope about the impact inflation is having on benefits. But first, Emma, how are politicians reacting? 

EMMA- Well, the government isn’t giving us much information, but they have sent us a statement which says that, ‘We know that living with a long-term illness or disability can impact on living costs, which is why are supporting 6 million disabled people with an extra £150 payment’. And when they say an extra £150 payment they mean the one that everyone’s just got or is about to get along with their PIP. And Nikki, at Wednesday’s Prime Minister’s Questions, Liz Truss didn’t give any assurances in regards to benefits, so at the moment we can’t say anything for certain. 

NIKKI- Well, let’s get an idea of how this is affecting everyday lives. Emma Blackmore has joined us. She lives in Bristol with her partner Natalie. Now, Emma is deaf, blind, has epilepsy and arthritis. Her partner Natalie works full time, whilst Emma works four hours a week. Hello Emma, thank you so much for joining us. 

EMMA B- Hello. Thanks for having me.

NIKKI- No, it’s totally our pleasure. Thank you, thank you. Now, Emma you’re fine with me saying, aren’t you, that you receive Personal Independence Payment, or PIP, and Employment and Support Allowance, ESA, which helps you to top up your wages, doesn’t it?

EMMA B- Yeah. 

NIKKI- Can you tell us a little bit about your current financial situation? 

EMMA B- So, obviously I work four hours a week, and Natalie does part time but does do other hours if she can, picks it up. Between us by payday basically by the time we’ve paid for rent, paid for council tax Natalie’s wages are pretty much gone. So, we rely on mine, which comes, apart from work wages, my benefits come twice every two weeks. So, my ESA comes every two weeks. And then we have my PIP it comes in the middle of the month. So, we basically rely on that. And once that’s come it’s gone within a day with the amount of bills we’re paying. 

NIKKI- So, that money just goes on bills, does it, Emma?

EMMA B- Pretty much bills. And we try and do a big shop, but at the moment we’re struggling to do a big shop. It is basically getting what we can in. It’s ridiculous but it’s what it is. 

NIKKI- What are your biggest bills, Emma? Where’s it going? 

EMMA B- I would say more so electric than anything, because obviously we have the medical equipment at home, which has then skyrocketed it. So, we have a sleep apnoea machine for Natalie. We have a fire alarm vibrating machine because I’m hard of hearing. And then we have an emergency buzzer, so if I fall at home it basically alerts family or an ambulance. So, between all three of that it skyrockets the electric bill ten times more than it would. 

EMMA- Can I ask you a really personal question, Emma? Are you in debt at the moment? 

EMMA B- Yes. We have our phone bills. I have to have a mobile because obviously if I’m out and about, I don’t tend to go out on my own, but if I’m on my own I have to be able to phone someone, so I have to have a mobile, I have to be able to pay that. I’m struggling to pay that. I just about do it. I’m having to borrow money off other people so I’m in debt with other people generally. 

EMMA- Oh dear. 

EMMA B- My mum – you know mums – it’s like yeah, pay me back when you’ve got it. But I feel bad. But there are other people that I owe money to that I don’t have that choice that I need to pay them back. 

NIKKI- Quite a few years ago I was in quite a lot of debt and it was more than you would imagine. And when you owe people it consumes your every thought, doesn’t it? When you go to bed at night you worry; you wake up in the morning you worry; every letter that comes through you worry. It’s just constant, constant anxiety. 

EMMA B- Yes. It’s taken a big battering to my mental health. I’ve had to have CBT to help me with my mental health. It was struggling during the pandemic, and then obviously all of this happened and it’s just got worse. I’m trying to maintain it but it’s very difficult, very difficult. 

NIKKI- What are your immediate concerns going forward? Obviously you’ve explained that you are in some debt, you are struggling, your money’s going on bills alone. We’re going into winter soon. 

EMMA B- Yeah, that is my exact thought. I don’t live in the best accommodation either because it’s just not suitable for my needs. It’s very cold; I’ve not got a carpet.

NIKKI- What would you like government to do about this? 

EMMA B- I feel in my opinion disabled people have always been put on the backburner in a way. It’s nothing new that we’re experiencing right now; we are still being put quite at the back of the line. And I feel more people are coming forward and saying this isn’t right, they need to listen to us and maybe listen to our stories more and see that we are seriously struggling, and do something to seriously help us. I hate to say it, there’s going to be deaths this winter, that’s how bad it is. 

NIKKI- Emma, we’re just going to speak now to James Taylor, but stay on the line. James is the director of strategy at Scope. James, you also have spina bifida, don’t you? 

JAMES- I do. 

NIKKI- You’ve worked at Scope for six years?

JAMES- That’s right yeah, a long time. 

NIKKI- It would be great to get from your perspective what you're seeing in terms of the direct impact that the cost of living crisis is having on specifically disabled people. 

JAMES- Yeah, and I think actually in my six years at Scope this is the worst I have seen. 

NIKKI- Really?

JAMES- The direct impact that we’ve heard from Emma is happening up and down the country behind closed doors. We speak to people at Scope day in, day out who are not turning on their heating, they are not turning on lights, they are not turning on fridges, even though they have medicine that they might need to keep cold, there are people who are eating once a day. This isn’t just a cost of living crisis, this is a cost of surviving, a cost of eating, and a cost of  heating crisis too. There are so many factors feeding into this crisis at the moment that it needs a response from the whole of government, and I think just to get a grip of what’s going on. 

NIKKI- I mean, you’ve said, haven’t you James, that it will be disastrous if the government doesn’t bring disability benefits in line with inflation. Can you just lay out why that is?

JAMES- It will be disastrous. And our welfare system and disability benefits and all benefits are there to provide support to people who are in difficult situations. Disability benefits are there because being disabled in this country costs more. They’re not there to support someone’s lifestyle, they’re not there to help people pay for TVs or luxuries. These benefits at the moment are supporting people to survive. 

NIKKI- Yeah.

JAMES- And actually lots of people in work are claiming benefits too. If benefits aren’t uprated with inflation in April, if they don’t go up by 10%, disabled people will see cuts. And that is really concerning. And that is why we need government to commit to uprating sooner rather than later. 

NIKKI- I’ve heard this argument, James, on various radio stations, when they’re vox-popping really and getting the opinions of the public, and I’ve heard the opinion don’t forget about us, people who aren’t on benefits, people who are working full time – I’m talking about people who aren’t disabled here. How would you explain why it’s so important and why it would be so devastating if benefits didn’t rise?

JAMES- One of the key values of this country is compassion. And one of the key things that I think most of us, and I’d like to think many of us care about, is equality and fairness. And by providing a welfare state and a welfare system and benefits payments to people it’s a demonstration that there isn’t fairness. And suggesting that we shouldn’t be supporting these people to me goes against the very values that this country is based on and that our government should be working towards. So, it is really tough for everybody, but it’s even tougher for those who are living in poverty, who have a disability, who are perhaps a single parent, who are a carer or an unpaid carer. And we have a moral duty to make sure they don’t fall any deeper into poverty. These benefits payments that we’re talking about, whether that’s Universal Credit or PIP or Employment Support Allowance, they’re not huge amounts of money, sadly, and they’re not enabling people to live a life of luxury. They’re enabling people to get by day to day at the moment. 

NIKKI- And I know you’ve done research at Scope; what are you calling on the government to do?

JAMES- There are three things we want the government to do. The first is to commit to uprate all benefits in line with inflation, with the 10% figure that was announced this week. The second is to get money to disabled households quickly. We’ve had a £150 disability payment which began to be distributed at the start of this month; we think that needs to happen again very quickly, December, January time, to get people through the winter. And the third is the introduction of a social tariff for energy bills, one that is slightly cheaper for people who maybe need to use more energy because of their disability. 

EMMA- So, like the one they have for broadband? 

JAMES- Exactly like that. If you receive benefits or if you have a disability or if you’re over a certain age you can get a basic broadband package that’s substantially cheaper. We want to see the same in the energy market too. 

EMMA- And Nikki, you were saying on the One Show that very, very few people actually know about it or use that social tariff for the broadband. 

NIKKI- Yeah.

EMMA- So, it’s about communication as well. 

EMMA B- Sorry, I didn’t even know about that, and I’ve got broadband. 

NIKKI- Did you not, Emma?

EMMA B- No. 

EMMA- So yeah, definitely look into that social tariff for your broadband, Emma.

EMMA B- Thank you. I’ll get onto that. 

NIKKI- 100%. Thank you both so much for joining us. Now, obviously this issue isn’t going away, and we’re going to continue to follow it. we want to hear your stories and your opinions, just like Emma. So, should benefits rise in line with inflation? Do you feel like your money isn’t stretching as far as it used to? And do you have any money saving tips to share with us? That would be good, wouldn’t it, some money saving tips? 

EMMA- Yeah, tweet them, email them, send them on the WhatsApp. 

MUSIC- Access All with Nikki Fox.

NIKKI- Now, our guest this week is Victoria Jenkins. And she is phenomenal. She’s the founder of Unhidden, which is a clothing line designed with disabled people in mind, and aimed at young professionals – that’s me and you Em.

EMMA- Oh yeah, young professionals. 

NIKKI- Young professionals. She’s also just been awarded third place of this year’s Sure Trust Disability Power 100 list. So, let’s find out why, why did she get to number three. Hey Victoria, congratulations on the win. 

VICTORIA- Thank you. Thank you so much. It still doesn’t feel real to be honest. 

NIKKI- I love it. What are you going to do with all that power? 

VICTORIA- Hopefully make some change. That’s the goal, that’s the target. 

NIKKI- Tell us a little bit about Unhidden.

VICTORIA- I studied fashion design and worked as a garment tech. in my mid 20s I had an undiagnosed stomach ulcer which burst and, a little bit of lifesaving surgery, and then because of that I had lots of other surgeries and slowly descended into this beautiful disabled community. And I was in hospital and it was a patient that told me she couldn’t dress how she wanted to. And it just made me think oh yeah, every time I’ve had surgery I’ve just not gone out until I can wear jeans again or I can wear trousers again. And for some people they don’t have that choice, that’s their whole life; it’s not like they recover from surgery. And even now I still struggle with woven trousers that don’t stretch, and jeans. And so it was kind of born out of that. And that was in 2016. I registered it in 2017, and then quit my job and went freelance. Most of all of this has happened with launching it thanks to COVID, which feels very weird to say, but COVID sort of gave me that time. 

NIKKI- I know. It’s a bit perverse actually that some good things did actually come out of COVID, didn’t they? I always say that. But you glossed over it a bit there, Victoria, but you have had one seriously impressive fashion career before Unhidden. You worked for Victoria Beckham’s label didn’t you as well?

VICTORIA- Yes, on the tailoring. The clothes there I do miss them. I do miss getting to touch clothes like that every day. Obviously I try to bring in the constructions methods to Unhidden, so it’s not all gone. 

NIKKI- Yeah. I know very much, as somebody that sits down pretty much all the time, as I’ve got older the tummy is always an issue, things digging in, I swell by the end of the day – all of this stuff that I know you’re very aware of. But what are the other kind of problems that disabled people face when it comes to dressing anyway, but dressing in fashionable clothes as well?

VICTORIA- Well, there are a few things. There are dexterity considerations. We all know buttons are a pain in the butt. I use snap fastenings, and I’m working really hard to get decent magnets, but they’re quite expensive. Seamstresses do not enjoy hand sewing in each magnet, but they’re not fans so I’m trying to find a way to make that a bit easier. And then a lot of the other considerations it’s a lot to do with dignity and access. If you’re going through radiotherapy you can access your arm through the shirt without having to take the whole shirt off. 

NIKKI- How does it all work? What’s your team like? It’s very impressive. 

VICTORIA- Thank you. Well, team is mostly just me. 

NIKKI- Oh wow.

VICTORIA- It’s all been done from my basement flat really, which is why it all feels very surreal. But everything is made in Bulgaria, a woman owned and run factory, which is fabulous. And because of the work they’re doing with me now I’m starting to look into how they can hire and train disabled people to work in the factories. Because there are not enough garment workers and garment professionals anymore. Younger people aren’t taking it up. I would have loved to have made in the UK; the downside being it is of course much more expensive. The shirts, for example, I was quoted £179, and that’s just to get it made. That doesn’t include the cost of the fabric, any kind of profit margin, the trims. I’d have had to retail it for £330.

NIKKI- Wow.

VICTORIA- And I can’t say that I’m for the disabled community and then charge that kind of money. The price points are still not as accessible as I want them to be because I’ve been doing things made to order. But I’m about to place my first stock order, so prices will come down and people aren’t going to have to wait so long for their items to arrive. 

EMMA- So, stock order, that’s a bulk order?

VICTORIA- Yes. When you’re buying fabric in bulk and when you’re having things made on a line in a factory just the cost of everything comes down. And I’m going to pass that cost difference onto the consumer. I’ve always published exactly what everything costs to get made, and I’ll continue to do that. 

EMMA- What’s your best seller? 

VICTORIA- The trousers. Across all four of them, because there’s seated and standing with a wrap, and seated and standing sort of a more masculine look.  

EMMA- You said trousers with a wrap, what does that mean? 

VICTORIA- There’s a wrap on the front that actually you can adjust it, so you can open it up to three times throughout the day. So, as your stomach bloats, or if it’s uncomfortable, you can sort of tighten it or loosen it as you need. 

NIKKI- You know, I’ve covered a lot about the fashion industry and disability, Victoria, in the past for BBC News, and we are seeing more disability on the catwalk and we’re hearing more about adaptive clothing. But I do feel like that particular industry doesn’t move forward as quickly as other areas. How do you feel about the fashion industry? I mean, is it a good career choice for disabled people? I’m thinking of like disabled models, I’m also thinking about people that make clothes like you. 

VICTORIA- Sometimes it’s a very toxic industry. It was very difficult for me to work in an industry, just generally to work and be unwell and have people be accommodating. My reasonable accommodation was always remote working, which was always denied. Funnily enough now we can all do it. I do think it’s getting better. I think they’re very late to the table. And I say that quite a lot to a lot of brands, you’re already late, you’ve got no excuse, you’ve got to start now, don’t wait until it’s perfect, don’t go out and do years of research, start. My longer term goal is I would really like to have a scholarship fund to encourage people with disabilities into the industry, because I think in terms of creative problem solving we’re one of the best communities in the world for that. How many head offices are accessible? Most fashion events are not accessible. They think ramps or a disabled bathroom that’s all that they need, maybe they’ll do BSL; but there are so many other considerations that just aren’t taken into account. And I think on top of that it’s not obviously welcoming to the disabled community, so if people don’t feel like they’re wanted they’re not going to show up. So, I think they need to start making their content accessible and to start using the right language and engaging more. And I also think they really need to stop celebrating when they’ve used one model for a campaign. 

EMMA- Yeah. 

VICTORIA- And getting loads of press for it. I’m like you should already be doing this; you shouldn’t be applauded for doing it finally. And the same applies to race and ethnicity and age and LGBTQ. We shouldn’t be applauding people for crumbs. 

EMMA- Actually you said the content accessible, that’s an interesting one because if there were better descriptions of clothing on websites, and descriptions of models and their outfits and what they’re wearing and how they can be interchanged, that would help me massively as a blind person, I have to say. So, is the current solution do you think collaborating with other brands? Because you’ve had a couple of exciting collaborations come recently. You’ve had Lucy & Yak.

VICTORIA- Yes.

EMMA- But also I think it’s funny because in 2014 someone wrote that there are more clothes for dogs than there are for disabled people, and now you’ve got Paw Patrol. So, is there a new disabled pop in adventure bay that you’re going to kit out? Is that what you’re going to do in the future? 

VICTORIA- Well, no. So, what I’m going to be doing with that is developing adaptive kids wear using Paw Patrol imagery, which is super exciting. Children with disabilities if they can’t wear the same clothes as all their peers it’s very exclusionary. And the amount of people that love Paw Patrol, and my plan is to put Rex on all of the labelling and swing tickets if I use them, to have Rex there so that he is there showing up on every single piece. 

EMMA- Oh, what’s Rex’s disability? 

VICTORIA- He’s got sort of a chair at the back. 

NIKKI- Oh, like an old doggie wheelchair?

VICTORIA- Yeah. 

NIKKI- Would you like your clothing to go into other stores? 

VICTORIA- That is the hope. I’ve spoken to some of the people that could make that happen. But there’s so much red tape and paperwork and all the rest of it that it just makes it really hard to make anything happen quickly. 

NIKKI- I wouldn’t mind quitting my day job and joining the team, if that’s all right, Victoria?

VICTORIA- Yeah, come and join the team. That would be amazing. Sorry there’s a lot of noise, I’m in the kitchen on set.

NIKKI- On set where? 

VICTORIA- I can say where I am. I’m in Wales. But I can’t tell you what we’re doing yet. 

NIKKI- Ooh, is this an exciting announcement that we’re not allowed to know yet but you might come back on Access All and tell us?

VICTORIA- I can’t let anything else out of the bag, but you’ll see next year. 

NIKKI- Ooh, will you come back on and tell us all about it?

VICTORIA- Yes, I will because it’s very exciting. 

NIKKI- So, that’s what’s next for you. Anything else we don’t know? 

VICTORIA- I’ve got my first full runway solo show in February. It was meant to be in September, but due to the passing of Queen Elizabeth I made the decision, very difficult decision, to not show. London was flooded with half the country, trying to get 25 disabled models in and out of London and across London just felt like it was just going to add too much stress. And I wanted the models to have an incredible experience. 

EMMA- She is top notch, and I think we’ll be hearing a lot more from Victoria Jenkins this year. 

NIKKI- Hey Emma, I’ve just had a thought. 

EMMA- What? 

NIKKI- If we ever, I don’t know, let’s just say Access All were one day nominated for some kind of fancy pants podcast award, we could commission Victoria to design outfits for us. 

EMMA- Yeah, because she was also saying that she’s going to put QR codes on the labels for blind people, where you could just touch it with your phone and you’d get all the descriptions of the clothes and the colours and the washing information etc. So, that’s a good enough reason for me to wear her adaptive clothing.

NIKKI- I can’t believe that’s not done anyway. If you like what you hear subscribe to us on BBC Sounds, that would be lovely. And you can tell your friends about us, anyone you like, because it really does help us to get heard by others. And you can rate and do all of that kind of stuff that you can do with all podcasts. 

EMMA- You can even send a review if you’ve got time on your hands. 

NIKKI- Yeah. thank you for listening and we’ll see you next week. 

EMMA- Bye. 

JUSTIN- So, Sarah, we’ve been asked to put together a trail for Americast. What do you think we should put in?

SARAH- Well, is it too obvious to just say that we’ll be covering all the biggest stories that a coming out of America? 

CLIP- We have to be prepared to tear it all up because something that we’re not expecting is going to happen. 

JUSTIN- I think that works, but it’s not just that, is it? We need to talk about the undercover voters investigation, looking at what’s happening online, what everyone’s getting in their social media feeds. 

CLIP- What they allow us to see is what someone who has a specific set of views or is from a specific demographic or a specific place might be seeing on their feeds.  

SARAH- And of course we’ve also got to mention all the amazing guests and experts that we have on the show helping us understand the stories. 

CLIP- This is a great talking point for him in the court of public opinion, but it is not going to go very far in a court of law.

JUSTIN- And Americast of course isn’t just about politics and news, is it? Can we get something in about the more cultural, the social stuff too?

CLIP- It kind of is in keeping with the conversations that we’re having in this country about race and colonialism and the legacy of those things. 

SARAH- Yeah, as long as you include that I think that about covers what we do. 

JUSTIN- And then all I need to say at the end is, Americast is a podcast from BBC News and you can find it on BBC Sounds. 

SARAH- Yeah, well you have just said that.