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I would definitely ask you about how you accurately. Track employees accountability and productivity. But before that, I'm curious just how has your background sort of shaped this company and LED you to get it started and what made you sort of get into this business? Yeah, to Magic started now. It started back in 2012 and it was actually branded under a different name and it was called Invoice for Time. And so you know if you go back before Invoice for Time back before 2012. Had a software consulting business where? You know, I would go out to the clients or the companies and then help them, you know, write software to help them become, you know, more efficient, right? And it could be anything from me writing a web application or something behind the scenes, you know, manipulating data back and forth. But the end goal was just to make the companies more efficient using software. And so how this all worked was I would be at a client site and maybe most of the week I might be at this client. But then, you know, another part of the week I might be, you know, over at another client side. And then also if the workload was allowed, I'd have other consultants as well who could help out, right, and work with me. And so basically I needed a way to log my time and also any other consultants time as well so that then I could actually create the invoices and send that over to the clients. And So what I did was, and this is what I think many businesses do, they go to their Excel spreadsheet and they say. Can I log all my time there? Right. And so that's what I was doing, throwing all that time in a spreadsheet. So basically I was tracking the amount of hours I worked each day for a client. And then if I had a contractor as well, I would also need to make sure that those hours got into that spreadsheet as well. And, and this worked, this worked really well, you know, especially at that point. I wasn't billing for thousands of hours every two weeks, right? It was, it was in the amount of data that I had was relatively easy and small. So basically I was telling up the hours in Excel, creating an invoice off and sending it over to the client, right And so. Again, I this did work really well, but there was one time that I screwed up an invoice and I felt terrible about it and I basically just build the client wrong and. And you know, at that time, and this has been many years back, but I remember I was, you know, I was double and triple checking my work and before I create that invoice, but for some reason, somehow that invoice, you know, something went wrong. Either way, I screwed it up. And what? And what made me kind of frustrated about it is that, you know, it made me look bad, it made my company look bad. And then I knew that that client that I invoiced wrong, I know they're going to be scrutinizing my invoices from then on even further than they were. And so I thought, you know what, there's just got to be a better way of doing this. And so then I did what I think a lot of people do is I Googled time tracking software and I found this is back in 2012. Three, 2012 actually there was hundreds of them out there, right? Nowadays I'm guessing there might be thousands. There are so many time tracking applications out there and so really going through that list, it can really be overwhelming because there's just so many and you want to find one that really fits your organization, right so then. You know, and what I did is I narrowed those hundreds of of applications down to like a couple and I was, you know, trying these out, kind of doing a proof of concept to see what really works well with my business. And from what I remember, and again this has been a long time, was that none of these applications were simple to use. You know, I just wanted to enter some time maybe in a timesheet and then create an invoice. That was it, right? And if at all possible, and this would be like icing on the cake, would be to allow my consultants to enter their time as well. But that really wasn't a must have. So like I said, the process to really enter time, create that invoice just wasn't simple and easy to understand, right? So, you know, boiling it down, I could have, I mean, I spent probably a couple of weeks demoing. I could have spent another couple of weeks and it would have probably made a little more sense, right? But I guess I was just, I was just frustrated that I really couldn't find something to do what I really thought was a simple task. And so. Yeah, from there. And then I started looking at myself and I said, Dan, duh, you're a software developer, why don't you just write it? If I really think it's that simple, why don't I just write it? And then I get exactly what I want for my business, right. So I step back a little bit and it was, I don't remember how long, but it was probably three to four weeks later. I put a web application out there and it allowed me to enter time in a simple timesheet. And so then I could be at the client side entering my time on a daily basis. And I also don't have to worry about did I enter those time in that spreadsheet? I don't want to forget about that, right? And so this worked really great because the data was in one place. I could access it anywhere. And then also I could invoice my clients based upon that data. And then I could sleep a little better at night just because I know that invoice. Was, you know, going to be a lot more correct than what I had in that spreadsheet and whatnot. So there's less points of failure and and so, yeah, this worked really well. Yeah. I love that approach you take. You decided to you find a solution. You decided to take matters into your own hands and just find and make something that works to your needs and likely solves other people's issues as well, right, Other business. Entrepreneurs. Yeah, yeah. And it, it, it worked really well for my business. So, you know, Even so, what I thought about was that, well, wait, you know, there's got to be other companies that might have a similar situation to me. And so this was after, I don't know, I probably was using it for six months to a year. I don't really remember. But I threw it. I said, you know, let's let's go ahead and just put a merchant account behind it and let's just see if other companies could use this. And so at that point that's when that web application I had got branded into invoice for time and that was in 2012 and so. Yeah, So then we I did get some companies to start using the application, but it wasn't a lot just because it really kind of fit the niche of a smaller company similar to mine, right. And so when these, you know, we get these companies that were demoing invoice for time at that point, they were saying, yeah, you know, it works. It's too simplistic, meaning that there's just a lot of other things that it needed like expenses like notifications approval system is a big. Better reporting so you can really get into that data better, right? And so taking that back and thinking, well, to make this really fit a wider audience, I guess that's, you know, what needs to be done. And so behind the scenes, and this wasn't an easy process. This wasn't the simple process. Put all this stuff in place. I think it took three to four years. So then back in from 2012 to 2016. All those items that were really needed were put in place. And then also that's when to Magix, the name was born. So in 2016 we rebranded invoice for time over to to Magix and it had all those bells and whistles, right? And it fit that bigger audience at that point. And so, yeah, from then, you know, 2016 to now, there's been just more enhancements that have been added and enhancements happen, you know, all the time, but. At the same time. It's, it's very important to keep the time tracking simple and easy to understand. That's kind of where I started with this. I just don't ever want to sacrifice the simplicity and ease of use to adding complexity with a lot of other stuff. But I mean, there's always gotta be a balance there, but simplicity and ease of use has to be a priority, so. Yeah, that's, that's kind of the long story of demographics. No, I I love that. I appreciate you sharing. That's I'm always so interested to see how a company was started and the fact that you started in 2012. I mean, this is this is like a completely different time for the Internet, right? You know, societally we weren't as dependent on the Internet as we are now. I'm curious has time objects, which by the way, I think that was the smart branding choice. I like the I like the name. It flows a little better than this. Thanks for your time, but has has has it always been a cloud based software solution or was it originally offered as on premises software? We've been asked that to be on premise, but that isn't just it's all cloud based and there really isn't any. Anything in the works to ever move it on Prem? OK. No, that's, that's totally fair. I think that is where it's headed and you're sort of ahead of your time at least back in 2012. With with that offering. Now with that, 2012 was a long time ago. And nowadays there are people, there are more people than ever working from home, largely to the COVID pandemic, which sort of jump us into the future a good ten years or so. How would you say this sort of affected your business? Yeah, since around like 2020 when many employees were, you know, they're sent home to work remotely. The business of to Magic really picked up at that point. And a big factor for that was that, you know why companies started turning to to magics and not only to magics, but other applications as well, was that accountability, right? They wanted to know that, you know, they want to know what their remote workforce was working on and if they are really working, right. So, and basically, if an employee knows that they need to enter time on a project or task, especially on a daily schedule, this can really make them. Really more accountable, but also more efficient as well, right? Yeah. And another struggle other than accountability was that. You really lost that FaceTime you used to have while working on site and with that, you know that lack of monitoring. It can be easy to lose track of what your employees are working on. Now. Being a business owner or manager, I used to be able to walk over and know what each of my employees, you know what they were doing just by talking with them. But now with this remote work, that isn't easily possible. And you can always do it with video calls, but it was just always easier. To just walk over and see someone. Now with the time tracking application, I can easily see what project or task one of my employees worked on yesterday or last week or last month without having to call them. And not that a call isn't bad or anything, I'm just, I'm just stating that it's very easy and quick to see where time is being spent, right. And so to kind of recap, I would just say it's the accountability and then. Also be able to quickly and easily know where your employer spending time on. I mean those are the big factors and that's, I mean I think that's why damages and I'm sure other time app tracking applications as well picked up a lot of business during that time. Yeah. Imagine there has been an explosion of different competitors and I know you mentioned that there were hundreds of different competitors when you first launched and now there's probably thousands. How are you sort of combating or competing against some of these companies that are also competing for the same customers? And why would you say, you know, one customer would go to time objects over another time tracking company?