Short Guide for Wrye Bash, Synthesis, and Mator Smash for OWL
Please help correct any mistakes or share other methods for this, thanks!
Please help correct any mistakes or share other methods for this, thanks!
Hi, I've been experimenting with how to get leveled lists to work well together with OWL. Personally I love how OWL distributes gear by selecting it from a group based on its class/type, but sometimes there's a problem where level 1 bandits can drop level 30 gear for example. This means that there is a conflict in the leveled lists either by load order or missing/incorrect patches. You'll often hear the term "Bashed patch" when it comes to leveled lists. This type of patch basically takes all of those leveled lists and organizes them to play well with each other to avoid the problem described earlier.
For this we need the following programs:
- Wrye Bash (309.1 as of writing)
- Synthesis
- Mator Smash - Optional
- xEdit (SSEEdit) or zEdit - Optional, but recommended
I would like to stress that Mator Smash (smashed patch) is completely optional, but it can solve several conflicts with a big load order which is why people rely on it. You skip this step if you want to! This is mostly aimed for people that have smash in their mod workflow in general and want to adapt it with OWL. Also assuming you have Wrye Bash, Mator Smash, and Synthesis installed and ready to go (refer to their pages for help installing).
Some rules that I follow for OWL:
- Generally, don't use weapon/armor mods that add to leveled lists without a patch. (Some mods work without patches, check compatibility article or posts). Always check in xEdit to be sure.
- Load order of patches does matter (for example RFM - CACO patches).
- Sometimes less is more. You don't need every weapon/armor mod in existence installed at the same time.
- Endorse mods - click it
I think the most important part is your load order, which LOOT doesn't always get right (especially for the patches). As mentioned in the mod description, place OWL close to the bottom of your load order followed by it's patches and before the bashed patch.
- Tip: Set up user metadata (LOOT rules) to keep the order for OWL and it's patches specifically for future cases.
Here is an example of my load order:
Wrye Bash:
I'm using SkyrimVR so I'm not sure if the Wrye Bash profile is different for SE, but the principal should be the same. In Wrye Bash make sure that you have under 254 plugins loaded or it won't include anything above the limit. (This might be different for SE due to ESL's?)
1. Before creating a bashed patch, deactivate these mods either in your mod manager or in Wrye Bash:
OWL Randomized Special Loot.esp
Smashed Patch.esp
Synthesis.esp
DynDOLOD.esp (optional)
2. Right-click Bashed Patch, 0.esp, Rebuild patch...
- A pop-up will appear asking if you want to deactivate and merge mods. Here is where it depends on how you manage your other mods. Personally I use Wrye Bash to merge mods since ESP slots are limited for VR, but if you rely on Smash for conflict resolutions it might be better to not merge, etc. It varies from case to case. If you're unsure, don't merge mods.
- If you are merging, untick all OWL patches then click OK. Select "Skip" if you do not want to merge any plugins.
3. Here you can select what gets merged into the bashed patch. We want "Leveled Lists" and "Import Inventory" to be ticked, the others again depends on how you want to manage your other mods. I use default settings including merges.
4. Go to the Leveled Lists tab and check the order of things (mainly OWL patches), tick Automatic. The order should be thesame as your load order.
- Tip: Untick automatic to add/remove any leveled lists manually (Scarcity needs to be added manually I think).
Do not include these .esp's when creating a leveled list:
WACCF_BashedPatchLvlListFix.esp
OWL Randomized Special Loot.esp
- Tip: Hide WACCF_BashedPatchLvlListFix.esp in MO2, you do not need it for OWL and many patches replace it.
- Tip: If OWL Randomized Special Loot.esp shows up when you tick automatic, exit the menu and deactivate the plugin (Sometimes you need to restart Wrye Bash or build a bashed patch for it to forget it), if you don't do this it will get included in leveled lists regardless if it doesn't show up in the Leveled Lists tab itself.
Here is an example of my leveled lists tab:
5. Build Patch...
- Check and see the merged leveled lists section in the log. You should not see any entries from "OWL Randomized Special Loot.esp". Also Open World Loot.esp and it's patches will be listed in order for each entry like this:
6. Activate any mods you deactivated in step 1 (Special Loot etc.) and activate the bashed patch mod in your mod manager.
- The load order for bashed patch is typically after all the mods it patches, but before "OWL Randomized Special Loot.esp". (Check screenshots earlier)
If you're only using bashed patch, you are done! However, I recommend using "Open World Loot Consistency Synthesis Patcher" after creating the bashed patch.
Synthesis:
Here is how I think of this process:
While Wrye Bash creates/merges the leveled lists, the Synthesis patch distributes them to everything else bashed didn't reach!
"Open World Loot Consistency Synthesis Patcher" is very simple to use and is honestly just amazing, (only 11 endorses as of writing this?)
1. Download Open World Loot Consistency Synthesis Patcher, or just search for it inside Synthesis.
2. Search In Synthesis method: Install the patcher by selecting the first white icon on the top left (Git Repository), and search for "OWLPatcher", Add Patcher.
- Set Mutagen and Synthesis to "Latest". It should say "Ready" on the top of the window.
3. Press the paper airplane button to run the patcher.
- Tip: If you have any errors while patching, check the mod page for help.
4. Exit and activate the created Synthesis.esp in your mod launcher. Load order is Bashed Patch -> OWL Randomized Special Loot -> Synthesis
Tip: If you've changed some mods and Synthesis is reporting missing masters, run the patcher again and it will correct them.
If you are not using a smashed patch, you're all good to go! Check in xEdit to make sure of changes.
Mator Smash:
Very little up-to-date information is out there for Mator Smash especially, but I think it is still an awesome program for easy conflict patching. However, the one thing it messes up is leveled lists with OWL. The way it works is that it will include all entries directly from weapon mod leveled lists along with OWL/patches leveled lists so it's all of them combined into one. This defeats the purpose of the OWL Gear Framework (WryeBash and Synthesis patches).
One way to get around this is to create a new smash rule to exclude all Leveled Lists from the smashed patch so it doesn't affect OWL in a major way. I found a Reddit page that explained how to do it very well. Again, I'm using the Skyrim VR profile, but I think it is the same for SE.
1. In Mator Smash, do not load the following:
OWL Randomized Special Loot.esp
Synthesis.esp
DynDOLOD.esp
- Include the Bashed Patch, 0.esp in the load!
- Tip: If you merged plugins in Wrye Bash, keep the deactivated mods deactivated, do not select them in Mator Smash.
2. On the top panel, select "Manage smash settings" (screwdriver/wrench icon). Here you can create rules that smash follows, we will create a new one.
3. Scroll down to the bottom, right-click on "Smash.All" and select "Clone setting".
4. It will create "Smash.All-Clone" on the bottom of the list, make sure to select it. Click on the arrow on the right to expand Records tab.
- Here you can choose the settings that work for your load order, for me I keep all default and just disable the leveled lists.
5. Untick the following:
LVLI - Leveled ItemThese are optional but I would remove them:
[NPC_ -Non-Player Character (Actor)] -> INAM - Death item
LVLN - Leveled NPC
LVSP - Leveled Spell - Tip: You can adapt these to your own requirements, I include Non Player Character (Actor) because of the face morphs and some outfit conflicts (Dark face bug still exists in VR so everything is manually solved).
6. Name it something cool like "Smash.All.NoLeveledLists" and Save.
7. Select all the plugins that you want to include in the smashed patch (I just include all). Right-click and select Smash Setting > Smash > Smash.All.NoLeveledLists. You can now see the rule is applied for all plugins.
- Tip: you can hold shift to select multiple mods, ctrl+A doesn't work.
Optionally do the same but with Smash.ForceAll just for Bashed Patch, 0.esp (I've seen this recommended a few times, I think it catches some things the normal rules don't). Personally I do not do this because I don't want it to grab leveled list entries from the bashed patch.
8. Select "Create new smashed patch" from the top panel (Red cross)
- You can name this anything, "Smashed Patch" and "SmashedPatch.esp" is fine if it's your only smash.
9. Select everything again and right-click, Add to Patch > Smashed Patch. Now all mods should have a rule and patch associated with them.
10. Build Patches (Hammer icon)
- This is usually interesting to watch, I had around 4,500 entries in my smashed patch.
- Tip: if this is greyed out, go to the Patches tab, right-click the patch in question and select "Remove unloaded plugins".
11. Check the log for errors, exit the program with the default Windows cross on the top right, it will clean up.
The load order for this set up specifically is Bashed Patch -> OWL Randomized Special Loot -> Synthesis <-> Smashed Patch
- You can swap Synthesis and Smashed Patch around depending on your other patchers in Synthesis, I have mine after smashed patch.
Congratulations! you should now have OWL all set up with a smashed patch on top! Before you start a new playthrough, check xEdit explained in the next section.
xEdit:
Here is a very brief explanation of checking for errors in xEdit. Read about the OWL Gear Framework in the main mod description if you want to know how it works in more detail!
1. In xEdit find the bashed patch, 0.esp and look under leveled item, there will be a lot of conflicts.
2. Select any weapon/armor and check that the last plugin (Bashed Patch, Synthesis, or Smashed Patch) only includes OWL_... entries and not direct entries from the mods! (check screenshot below)
- Tip: There will be some that share OWL and mod entries, but these seem to be specific to weapon/armor/enemy type or the WACCF progression. For example, Heavy Armory seems to have some entries alongside OWL for it's special weapon types, but I think these are taken care of by the patch/Wryebash. Please correct me if I'm wrong, seems correct in-game.
If you have a situation that looks like this, you are missing a patch or included leveled lists in the smashed patch.
- This causes level 1 guys to drop Dwarven Battle-axes for example
Instead, Smashed Patch shouldn't have any leveled lists entries and the last plugin in this chain will by Synthesis that looks like this:
There might be some lone entries here and there, but as long as majority have the OWL prefix, they will use gear from the OWL Gear Framework. You can also see what weapons from mods and patches get added to each OWL category in the leveled lists category as well.
Hope this helps anyone who's curious about OWL and the leveled lists. Don't hesitate to ask for help or correct any mistakes here!
Have a nice day.
36 comments
One question about the addons from foreverphoenix though, I saw you answered about the AVL Morrowind Glass addon already but what about the Irons and Steel, Nordic and Thalmor ones, do those need to be included in the bashed patch for OWL and all it's other patches or can those be loaded safely after the bashed patch and still be integrated in the leveled lists seamlessly?
Also, when I set it to automatc in WryeBash it doesnt select all the patches, is tehre any way to fix that or do I just have to add them all manually?
Sorry, am a complete beginner when it comes to leveled lists.
Thanks!
You can also combine them with OWL if you want to, for this we need bashed patch. I just tested it with the Thalmor addon. Add relev and delev tags to the addon plugin in Wrye Bash, rebuild patch, in the leveled list tab it should show up in the list when you press automatic. (If it doesn't show up, place the plugin file before bashed patch in your load order/check you added the tags. You shouldn't be manually adding them in the list I think.). Bashed results.
Now to check in xEdit that they are combined, go to the bashed patch > Leveled item > SubListThalmorGlassArmorNoHelmet for example, we can see that they are combined!
Although this might not be the intended way to do it and you should probably just replace OWL variants by just having the plugin active after OWL/bashed patch, you can do this with any mod if you ever wanted to combine them for whatever reason!
Since we excluded the leveled lists in smash, we can just place the randomized loot after bashed patch in the load order.
I created the 'Bashed Patch, 0.esp' following the instructions in this guide and then opened a random item from the level list of the patch in xEdit.
For example, I opened LItemEnchWeaponMaceBlacksmith record. And it looks like 'Bashed Patch, 0.esp' just copied the record from Skyrim.esm, overriding any changes made by 'Open World Loot.esp' and 'OWL - Vanilla Progression.esp'.
Mods (columns) listed for this record:
Skyrim.esm | Open World Loot.esp | OWL - Vanilla Progression.esp | Bashed Patch, 0.esp
Here 'Bashed Patch, 0.esp' column contains each Leveled List Entry from the Skyrim.esm column and none Entries from 'Open World Loot.esp' or 'OWL - Vanilla Progression.esp'. So it looks like bashed patch reverted all changes done by OWL. That makes no sense to me. Actually, I suppose I understand why it did what it did (it's just a simple merging algorithm - how could it know what entries are more relevant than others?). But what I don't understand then is why so many people suggest to use Wrye Bash if it creates so broken "patches"?
The link to screenshot.
So, I don't get how Wrye Bash helps. It looks like it just messes out OWL Leveled List Entries overriding relevant entries with irrelevant entries. Is this how it is supposed to work or I'm doing something wrong?
Can you check what is selected in the Leveled Lists tab right before creating the bashed patch or post bashed patch log? Thanks!
Unfortunately, there is no log from the previous execution of Wrye Bash.
I tried the same again and here is the screenshot and the log:
* Leveled Lists of Bashed Patch?.
* Bashing log
But this time the result is different. Much better I must say.
E.g. the item from my previous post. As you see the bashed patch now doesn't include entries from Skyrim.esm and includes entries from OWL.
But it still ignores entries from 'OWL - Vanilla Progression.esp'. Maybe it's because there is no 'OWL - Vanilla Progression.esp' on my screenshot of the Leveled Lists tab right before creating the bashed patch. But if this is the reason, then why it's not there? I didn't unchecked it in the mod list. It's checked - I double-checked it.
Also I doubt that Wrye Bash will merge them correctly even if I will able to add 'OWL - Vanilla Progression.esp' to the Leveled List tab of Wrye Bash somehow. Because they shouldn't be merged in a general sense of the word. 'OWL - Vanilla Progression.esp' should replace OWL for items where it's intended. If Wrye Bash will blindly merge them, it will be a mess.
About Vanilla progression patch: it's an official patch from OWL Files section that just sorts dwarven/elven/orcish weapons back to vanilla order. In OWL it's: dwarven(15), elven(20), orcish(25). In OWL-VP it's: orcish(15), dwarven(20), elven(25).
About the Wrye Bash itself:
Side note: I'm a developer with 20 years experience, so feel free to put some technical terms here if it's required for explaining something.
I suppose I understand the idea. But I don't understand how the merging algorithm, implemented in Wrye Bash, could know what entries from leveled list (of single item) should be merged and what entries should be ignored because they removed by some mod (that is below in the load order) for a reason.
Maybe Wrye Bash just blindly merges entries of each record with "last mod wins" and that's all?
E.g. the example from the same Bashed patch for a different item.
Why it merged it like this? Why it took first 3 entries from Thaumaturgy, but ignored the next 3 entries from Thaumaturgy? What's the logic behind this?
Also you can always view previous Bash log by double-clicking the bashed patch, 0.esp inside Wrye Bash.
In any case, I really appreciate this writeup. Thank you :)